M30B35 Swap FAQ

[Les]

Thanks for the feedback

[Les]

so...
a used Bavarian provider supplied me with what was stated as a 1990 e34 harness....which turned out to be a later model e34 harness, using the x20 terminal, and a MAF connector
after trying to make this work with my '90 e34 motor and '87 e28 car, this has turned into a wiring nightmare
so now begins trying to source an '88 super eta harness

a few quick questions:

regarding the super eta harness, will this plug right into the 1.3 ecu ? (I know it is stated it will, but just want to make sure)
and will the 1.3 ecu operate accordingly or does it have to be 1.1 to run this harness?

secondly, the current engine has a cylinder ID sensor (coming off of the cap) and a magnetic crank sensor (mounted near the front crank wheel)
does the super eta harness use these ? or does it use the dual crank sensor as on the original b34 engine ?

again, any help is much appreciated

[Bimmerguy2002]

so...
a used Bavarian provider supplied me with what was stated as a 1990 e34 harness....which turned out to be a later model e34 harness, using the x20 terminal, and a MAF connector
after trying to make this work with my '90 e34 motor and '87 e28 car, this has turned into a wiring nightmare
so now begins trying to source an '88 super eta harness

a few quick questions:

regarding the super eta harness, will this plug right into the 1.3 ecu ? (I know it is stated it will, but just want to make sure)
and will the 1.3 ecu operate accordingly or does it have to be 1.1 to run this harness?

secondly, the current engine has a cylinder ID sensor (coming off of the cap) and a magnetic crank sensor (mounted near the front crank wheel)
does the super eta harness use these ? or does it use the dual crank sensor as on the original b34 engine ?

again, any help is much appreciated

Yes, it plugs right in, you need to extend 11 wires, 4 AFM, 3 TPS, 3 ICV, and 1 oil pressure switch. The super eta harness has everything you need, so does the m30b35 harness. They both use a front crank sensor.
I have a super eta harness FS if interested. You cant use an m50 harness.

[LA]

So I take it to cover the flywheel one would have to fabricate a cover?

Yes, if you are not using the E24 B35 block/pan/cover.

Another way to skin that cat is to use the cover from a Bavaria, Probably early E12s had the sheetmetal cover as well. No - all bolt holes do not align. Seems like two line right up and a drilled hole takes care of the other..as if two bolts would not hold it on...

[LA]

So - I've got most of the pieces, going to Motronic 1.3 on the E23 and the E28. Thanks for help with parts Matt (bimmerguy2002)!

Just wondering if the signals from the speed and reference sensors that are flywheel triggered are in phase with the signals from the #6 plug wire and the front balancer sensor? Not sure I want to do this but I see no reason for BMW to have changed the timing of the ECU inputs as the Motronic system evolved.

Before this thread enlighented me, I had thought of a 179 ecu using the bellhousing mounted sensors and homemade wiring as needed. Does anyone know if the speed and reference signals are the same from the bellhousing mounted sensors as they are from the #6 plug and front sensor?

EDIT ummm, never mind. I looked at the schematics. M1.3 is not so much an evolution of the orig Motronic sys as it is a clean sheet of paper design approach. Seems a shame,with the E28, not to have all the inputs needed for the diagnostic functions.

[Das_Prachtstrasse]

Attacking the M1.3 swap (well, 1.2 atm.. 150 ecu) in the e28 this week, as I got frustrated of the shit that is the 059.

Anywho, regarding fuel rails, is it necc. to install the b35 rail? I was intending on keeping the b34 rail due to it's provisions for the cold start valve, which has proved critical in the cold starting of my m106, and simply routing the fuel hoses as they were on the b34. I know a lot of you delete the CSV, but this particular car does not like it, so i'm inclined to keep it. Did the B35 have any cold start provisions?

Also, can someone confirm if the 150 and 179 harness' are the same? It's pulled from an auto 88 e34 535is, and i'm going to bet that it is, but would like to be sure for C101 etc wiring.

[rmiddendorf]

Did the B35 have any cold start provisions?

IIRC it didn't have a dedicated valve. My 88 635CSi (B35) did not have a CSV. I think they just integrated the management into the rest of the system- as in regulating the regular fuel injection system differently. I don't know enough about the M106 to tell you how that's going to work out though.

[LA]

Attacking the M1.3 swap (well, 1.2 atm.. 150 ecu) in the e28 this week, as I got frustrated of the shit that is the 059.

Anywho, regarding fuel rails, is it necc. to install the b35 rail? I was intending on keeping the b34 rail due to it's provisions for the cold start valve, which has proved critical in the cold starting of my m106, and simply routing the fuel hoses as they were on the b34. I know a lot of you delete the CSV, but this particular car does not like it, so i'm inclined to keep it. Did the B35 have any cold start provisions?

Also, can someone confirm if the 150 and 179 harness' are the same? It's pulled from an auto 88 e34 535is, and i'm going to bet that it is, but would like to be sure for C101 etc wiring.

I drilled three holes, tapped two of them on the boss on the b35 intake and bolted it on when still running the 059 ecu. CS valve worked fine. Don't know if 1.3 needs it.

[Das_Prachtstrasse]

Well i'm using the m106 manifold, upgraded to 1.3 engine harness. 1.3 doesn't have a harness connector for the CSV, and the fuel rail doesn't have provisions for it either, but i'm interested to know how the cold start scenario is metered differently between the two injection systems.

[LA]

Well i'm using the m106 manifold, upgraded to 1.3 engine harness. 1.3 doesn't have a harness connector for the CSV, and the fuel rail doesn't have provisions for it either, but i'm interested to know how the cold start scenario is metered differently between the two injection systems.

Can't help you there. But I do know the b34 rail and injectors work fine with 1.3. I bet a guy could add a temp sensor, use a b34 manifold (or mod. b35), and a b34 rail, and make it squirt below some temp. Have to figure out what temp sensor to use...

BUT - probably don't need it with b35 and M1.3 or there would be a lot of complaints...

[wkohler]

In Motronic 1.3, the cold-start enrichment is done through the standard injectors. No need for a dedicated injector. It just calls for more fuel when the motor is cold.

[Das_Prachtstrasse]

In Motronic 1.3, the cold-start enrichment is done through the standard injectors. No need for a dedicated injector. It just calls for more fuel when the motor is cold.

Confirmed my suspicions. Thanks, Chris.

[vinnie30]

Thanks a lot for this, I was trying to find info on the early vs late B35 and what the differences were.

[Bimmerguy2002]

if anyone is soldering the ends of the c101 connectors together, this may be a more simplified way of looking at it.
COLOR is always irrelevant since they are not always the same, so disregard it.

[savannah996]

Good chart, I used it yesterday. ▲

One thing to add to the swap list is:
1. When you pull the B35 harness, get both sides of the cannon plug. Cut as far back in the harness (about 12inches). So you can assemble what I did in my pic.
2. If you dont want to cut your E28 C101 plug off, ( I plan to swap my B34 into a E30) remember to find one of these in the junk yard also and cut it back from the plug about 12".

[savannah996]

This is the quick version. Finished this will be soldiered and taped up with new wire loom.

EDIT. I think part of this was a waste of time. There is no reason to keep the E32 cannon plug. I plan to wire the ecu directly to the C101 connector.

[Jean]

if anyone is soldering the ends of the c101 connectors together, this may be a more simplified way of looking at it.
COLOR is always irrelevant since they are not always the same, so disregard it.

You've come a long way with matching up the wires !

[LA]

if anyone is soldering the ends of the c101 connectors together, this may be a more simplified way of looking at it.
COLOR is always irrelevant since they are not always the same, so disregard it.

You've come a long way with matching up the wires !

Matt is off the charts when it comes to mechanical aptitude. The value of his contributions to the board far exceed the sum total of all input by the collective group of his adversaries.

The old adage about cutting off one's nose to spite their face has become a mye28.com reality.

Another old saying comes to mind - the one about making mountains out of molehills. I expect his so-called threat was intended to be humorous. In fact it hardly registers on the scale of nonsensical things that have been posted here.

[dave533i]

This thread is dynamite reading. I am in the "Parts Gathering" phase of the project. It will be some months before I begin the actual work.
So far I have gathered a rust-free 85 528e, an M30B35 from a late 88 or early 89 e34, a Getrag 265,a complete engine gasket set, and and a MegaSquirt ECU from my wrecked e12. The engine also came with an ECU, but the seller says it cross-referenced as a Motronic 1.1 on RealOEM.com. From what I am reading here I should try to get get the stock Motronic 1.3 ECU and then search for a Super Eta harness. Is that right? I also understand that the MegaSquirt has a whole different set of issues and its own web site, and is not appropriate for this thread. Is that also correct?

[lahmeboricua]

is there any difference in trying to swap th e34 engine into a 84 528e ?

[rmiddendorf]

is there any difference in trying to swap th e34 engine into a 84 528e ?

Motor mounts. Search for more as I don't remember the rest.

[95maxrider]

Hello everyone! This is quite the FAQ you have here!

I'm interested in doing an M30B35 swap and have read through this thread a few times now, and I think I can safely ask a couple questions without sounding like a complete moron.

First of all, it seems that this thread is for people who already have an M30B34 in their cars. I have a 1988 528e (yay for 1.1) with a 5-speed trans and the M20B27 motor. I seem to remember reading somewhere that the transmissions for the M20 motors will not bolt up to the M30 motors, but I haven't seen that mentioned anywhere in this thread, but that may be because this thread is for people who already have an M30 in their cars. Will I need to get a trans/clutch/flywheel from an M30 or can I reuse my stock trans/clutch/flywheel?

EDIT: Upon further research is appears as if the M20 E28s come with the G260/5 trans, and I need the G265 trans to work with the M30 motor. That alone will probably push the feasibility of the swap over the limit of what we have the money/patience for Can anyone explain what the differences are between the G265/5 and the G265/6 and which one would I need for my car?

I know a fellow in my neighborhood who has a ton of old BMWs he's always working on, and he mentioned that he thought I would have to relocate my master cylinder if I put an M30B35 in my car. Again, I saw no mention of that in this thread, but that may because this is for people who already have the M30B34. With my M20B27, will I be able to reuse my stock master cylinder in its original location?

It sounds like doing the full E34 harness and 1.3 ECU is the way to go for maximum gains and drive-ability, even though I already have the super-ETA harness in my car. Would anyone disagree?

I found an M30B35 from a 1991 E34 for sale, and would like to confirm some things with your guys before I buy it.

Here are the things I believe I will need to do the swap into my car after reading this thread. Please let me know if I'm missing something.
-Motor mount adapter since motor is from an E34
-O2 sensor (not sure if my car has one or not!)
-B34 gooseneck for coolant?
-E34 harness and 1.3 ECU from car without EML/traction control

It sounds like it has been confirmed that I won't have to swap oil pans/pickups from an E24 since the E34 pan will fit perfectly into the E28. Is this correct?

Also, on a side note, I'm curious to what you guys think my motor/ECU/harness is worth? It all has about 220k on it but seems to run great. Is there even a market for my parts?

Thank you guys for all of your knowledge and help!

In case anyone is bored/interested, I've got some pics and the story behind my 528e up on my usual board, Maxima.org.
http://forums.maxima.org/other-cars/652 ... ooker.html

And racing results and pics of my other car
http://forums.maxima.org/members-rides/ ... ead-3.html

http://forums.maxima.org/autocrossing-r ... lts-3.html

Nick

[Anjey1989]

hello! Bought myself an e28 518 and a m30b35 engine from e32 (with wiring,ECU's (Motronic;ABS and EML)) which had an electric throttle, since I am not planning of using electric throttle (EML) on my e28 is there any way to "recode" my Motronic control unit (so that it would be possible to use without EML ) or is it easier to get a Motronic from 535?

Maybe i am talking complete nonsense and this problem would be solved just by unplugging the EML control unit?

[kzolee]

Another version for right side mount, from 5 mm steel plate.

The koala motorsport was not so trustworthy for me...

[Bimmerguy2002]

hello! Bought myself an e28 518 and a m30b35 engine from e32 (with wiring,ECU's (Motronic;ABS and EML)) which had an electric throttle, since I am not planning of using electric throttle (EML) on my e28 is there any way to "recode" my Motronic control unit (so that it would be possible to use without EML ) or is it easier to get a Motronic from 535?

Maybe i am talking complete nonsense and this problem would be solved just by unplugging the EML control unit?

For the most part, no. It would be easier to just get a manual or auto harness without EML, and a plain old throttle body they are not rare by any means.

[kzolee]

If somebody wants to see how looks the E32/34 oil pan in E28 chassis:

(Sorry for the phone pics)









And the E32/34 manual transmission also fits:

[dave533i]

Sweet! It looks like sufficient clearance. Thus I won't have to buy an e28 oil pan. It is somewhat alarming how much of the motor sticks out forward of the mounts. It would appear front-heavy. I suppose there is no way around that.
Thanks for posting.

[AlpinaE24]

I just bought a B35 to strap all my alpina bits to, but first i need to swap out the E3 pan and sump for my E24 setup. I have read a ton of posts about this and just want to verify.

I can simply bolt the E24 pickup onto the B35 oil pump right? Or do i need to change out the whole pump? I have a 87/b34 pump that was on my M90...would I also have to change the sprocket and chain? Or just run the B35 sprocket and chain with tensioner?


Also, has anyone fabbed up a bracket to use a the B35 PS pump with the B34 pan? Seems easy enough

[Justin535turbo]

so im in the middle of this swap, actually in the home stretch. just did the C101 wiring connections last night. nobody has made mention of the relays in the harness up next to the DME connector. there are a few connections up there that look as though they should need to be taken care of. looks like main power input to relays and some grounds. it's up next to the ignition coil + and - . since nobody has made mention of them, i'd assume they don't matter. but im just making sure before i try to start this thing.

[Justin535turbo]

answer to my own question: YES!

as suspected, those are main power and some grounds for those relays, i believe one of them is the fuel pump relay, im not sure what the other one is. no start with them disconnected. add power and ground to them appropriately, and she starts! sweet. look like i've got some more wiring to run...